An Australian Championship

The art of distance casting is a complex one. Chat here with others also interested in distance casting, with a focus on Tournament Casting

Moderator: Jeremy Schrader

Post Reply
90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:46 pm

Proposal - Australian leader casting is, I'm very happy to say, in an excellent state at the moment, with Mr. Schrader excitedly calling each caster that wins a comp the current Australian number 1 :lol:

Let's make it fair dinkum and once a year hold a genuine Australian championship - no excuses, no doubts - turn up and cast to see who the best is, if you don't make it, your bad luck and you will have to wait until the next year.

We can even have a perpetual trophy.

Would be nice to have a real championship to look forward to as an added extra to our 'regular' comps.

What do you guys reckon?

I'm happy to propose this now as it is no longer just Lee and I that will fight it out - in fact, at the moment there are 4 casters who could possibly put their name on the trophy, and I could possibly end up 4th.

It would add some excitement to the build up, who is in form e.t.c...

I propose this championship to be held in Victoria for the moment, as that is where the most casters currently live - however with the option to alternate to other states if there is sufficient interest to warrant the move.

Proposal 2 - this will take some more debate maybe. Grades for the championship. A grade - if you have a recorded cast 230 metres or bigger - B Grade - 200 to 229 metres - C Grade - 160 to 199 metres - Grade placing to be based on results of 2 comps, with newbies to be placed automatically in C grade - only stipulation that if you have reached a grade, you can't have a slightly off day and win the grade below (meaning for instance that if you are in B grade, you can't win C grade with a cast of 199 metres). And as people age and find it more difficult to keep up with a grade they can 'apply' to the executive to move down a grade - we are all mates and wouldn't make people stay up a grade if they get as old as Jeremy.

I believe this grade system is dead simple, and adds some interest for all casters on the day. However, if you feel differently then no worries - it is just a suggestion.

As I no longer post very often, I would also like to take this opportunity to congratulate Nick on his victory recently - I'm sorry I couldn't make it down but delighted that so many casters showed up - the more guys that cast good, the better, as to be honest I had nearly lost interest completely, and now am seriously considering marching back down the practise field.

Scott...

Led
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 256
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 5:16 am
Location: Comms Manager

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Led » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:22 am

Scott,

That plan is absolutley brilliant, it's so good that if it had legs it would win the National.

8)

Tommy
Angler
Angler
Posts: 102
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 4:06 pm

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Tommy » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:35 am

Scott,

It is a great plan. Very similar to the SCUSA setup right down to the classes and perpetual trophy.

Jeremy is pretty old... i think he's got me by a few months.

:mrgreen:

Tommy

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:48 am

Never mind Tommy, I'm sure you've got him by a few kilos - I haven't been checking out the news of the world so to speak, how is your casting going?

Hello Mr. Miller, nice to hear from you - did you keep with the high swing you were mucking around with last year?

Scott...

Jeremy Schrader
Serious Angler
Serious Angler
Posts: 973
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2003 9:40 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Jeremy Schrader » Wed Feb 11, 2009 5:51 am

Scott ,

I fully support your suggestion and put forward that it be held on the Sunday of Queens birthday weekend which allows peolpe traveling time .

I will organise the trophiesin the near future and post images up once I have done so.

Also Tommy I agree that this old man is getting on :roll: I may have to train a bit more at the gym to give the young guys a run for their money. :mrgreen:

Tommy
Angler
Angler
Posts: 102
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 4:06 pm

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Tommy » Wed Feb 11, 2009 6:19 am

Kilos I've got.... lol

Casting is decent considering the lack of practice. When i have practiced it's been mostly off the ground, but i did dust off the ol flat arc for a few casts yesterday.

It's been a very hectic off season.

Are you coming to Texas in '10 ??

Tommy

EddieMacSqid
Angler
Angler
Posts: 139
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 9:38 am
Location: Adelaide

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by EddieMacSqid » Wed Feb 11, 2009 7:28 am

Excellent proposal Scott,

I would certainly come across for a comp on the June long weekend.

I like the idea of the grading system as Mark, Luke and myself already have our mini (sub 230) battle at the regular comps with only a few meters between us.
Also gives an added incentive to improve and advance to the next grade.

Scott,
You better get out there and practice as June is not that long away.
You can ‘apply’ but I won’t agree to you being in B-Grade :P .

Cheers
Eddie

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:22 am

Keep laughing Eddie - Keep laughing.

Jeremy, you will need to discuss matters with the other executive, and possibly wait until after the A.G.M in March in S.A before spending any cash at all - and even then, keeping it small is my suggestion - that money has to last.

Eddie - I tried to make the grades so there would be 3 sort of mini comps - I think they would work out - let me know when you turn 18 so you can apply for A grade.

Tommy - unless we get a team that I think is internationally competitive, I will never travel overseas again - I have had my time and happy to let others take their shot. We have guys with reasonable to very good pb's in comp in Australia, but not across the board of all 4 weights - we are improving, but not ready yet by a long shot until greater consistency with all 4 weights picks up.

Scott...

Giaco
Angler
Angler
Posts: 75
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2007 7:05 am

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Giaco » Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:34 am

Great idea Scott, competitions are the best way to improve. I ´m happy to hear that yo want to come back to the fields.

anglerman
Beginner
Beginner
Posts: 29
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:58 pm
Location: Venus Bay, Victoria
Contact:

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by anglerman » Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:39 pm

Guys

I think we can go one step further in that there should be two prizes

1 outright distance with any weight a caster chooses

2 an aggregate distance of the compulsory weights (100, 125, 150, 175)

This in a way raises a question as to what is the better caster?.

the one who casts the longest or the one who is more consistent over the four weights.

Graham

Led
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 256
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 5:16 am
Location: Comms Manager

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Led » Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:09 am

Hi Scotty - I'm great (well that's what I have to keep telling myself)

Hi-Swing - I reverted back, needed to keep up on my plug distance but during the winter months over hear the oches can become rather slippery so I have a variation with no feet movement which is way off the pace (need to watch the master again) :roll:

Keep with it and I look forward to seeing some results and vids of you, how's your Dad ?

lee
Angler
Angler
Posts: 128
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:13 am

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by lee » Fri Feb 13, 2009 1:52 am

As far as I'm concerned the longest cast no mater what weight cast, makes you the champion. An aggregate is little more than a prestigious award. Lets not forget that the whole point of this sport is to throw the furthest, no need to get bogged down in technicalities, the longest is the champ. Aggregate is a separate issue, an award of averages sure enough and something to be sought as an embellishment to the real deal. Like a cherry on top of the cake :mrgreen: . No one can push the limits to the limits unless there is a favourite weight. A year aggregate is a better idea, it's the only way to set huge records, giving a caster time to make adjustments from comp to comp instead of sacrificing over all distance to frig around with this weight and that. An aggregate championship will hold the sport back. Truly who among us wants to be a champ for four good casts?? or one insane cast? I'll take the one neck breaker any day, an aggregate seems like grasping at straws to save face because you cant pump out the goods when it counts. Biggest cast is what breaks records in a realistic sense, an average, well is just an average, tell me who holds the record for the average??? Probably only Led could spit out the answer off the top of his head with out looking it up, I cant, maybe its Sir Garry but I'm not really sure. What’s the world record?? Every one knows its 286m by DM at Whales off the top of their heads.....because it's the only one that matters. Just my humble opinion, although it doesn't seem so humble :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :mrgreen:

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Fri Feb 13, 2009 10:40 am

Why don't you tell us what you really feel Lee :lol: :lol:

For the record, I agree with Lee as I would feel like I lost the competition if I got the best aggregate but not the furthest cast ... however ...

I do believe that we should place some importance on the aggregate as well, as it is the only way we are ever going to have a competitive team. The argument about whether it is better to place casts in the field with different weights, or to go for the biggest, doesn't really have an answer but it is an important aspect of international competition.

For me, if there is a chance of a record on the day then I am going to stay with my favourite weight and go for it - and I think Lee and Nick would probably do the same.

My opinion is that the trophy e.t.c... is for the furthest cast - that is the real achievement on the day - but that we make mention of the aggregate as well.

Scott...

Sandgroper
Angler
Angler
Posts: 119
Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2004 6:59 pm
Location: Perth, WA

An Australian Championship

Post by Sandgroper » Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:11 pm

The concept of an Australian Champion is an excellent idea.

As can be clearly observed by the postings in this regard, the idea's on how to establish same is as varied as the number of postings.

Clearly, the longest cast, irrespective of what weight is used, SHOULD be the Champion.
This cast must be performed on a pre-determined competition date that would enable all those wishing to participate, to get there. When this is, can be discussed by the managing executive, and an informed decision made.

On a personal basis, I would also like to see:
1. Gradings - just as Scott has proposed on his Feb 10 posting.
2. Recognition of distances cast in each of the casting weights (50 gram through to 175 gram). ie: A national index of records. Big weights make big distances, but little weights really need some skill to get them out there as well.

That a NATIONAL competition be run is a 'no brainer'. It simply has to be.

Initially I would expect this to occur in the state where the most casters are prominent, with subsequent locations alternating between those states active within the comp. The decision as to which state hosts the competition to remain with the executive.

I would be prepared to donate the trophy for the "Australian Surfcasting Federation" - "National Casting Champion" based on the longest cast at the National event. Hopefully, this would alleviate the original cost of obtaining the prestigious award and get the concept on the road a bit quicker. (Might also be the only way I will get my name on it:) - as the donor)

Any idea's on what the trophy should look like would be appreciated. To my way of thinking, the size is inconsequential, it is the associated prestige is what counts. Something easily transportable, and easy to update.

Looking forward to March 7 & 8 in Adelaide.

Chas

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:31 pm

Chas, it is a nice offer to donate the trophy, but ... I strongly feel it should be purchased by the federation, for the federation.

I can't see how any decision can be made until we have a meeting anyway - but we don't need to feel particularly obliged to any state.

I am not too keen on having a rotation for casting - at the moment there are 2 casters only in S.A who regularly pendulum cast, and only 1 that shows up to comps, and only 2 guys in W.A (a third cast well for 1 comp, but only cast 1 comp) and only a couple in N.S.W.

As to who is the best caster - it is not clear that the longest cast should be the champion - Graham has a valid point, and whilst people like Lee and I go for the longest, there is a lot of merit on the aggregate as well. These are all only opinions, and will be decided at a meeting of members.

I think we need to slow down and realise that this is not an organisation forum, and realise that ANY decision, on money matters, trophies, rules - must be brought up at a meeting - and that if people have suggestions the might want to put them through the executive first.

I checked with Jeremy before posting my proposal.

Scott...

Led
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 256
Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2003 5:16 am
Location: Comms Manager

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Led » Sat Feb 14, 2009 6:04 am

Lee - the winner of the aggregate is the person not trying hard enough 8) I can muster more crack-offs than anyone, along with the best shoucker that digs in to the spool too :shock:

FWIW - the Champion should the person who casts the furthest with any of the nominated sinker/line options - plain and simple :mrgreen:

Have catagories by all means - it gives everyone a chance to inmprove & lets face it there are soem who have improved big time.

It's just a shame that you are all so far away as I think that you could muster a very formidable team that could win the CIPS World Championship :shock:

castingsport
Beginner
Beginner
Posts: 27
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 5:22 am

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by castingsport » Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:39 am

Great idea Gents,

Just a suggestion but how about getting the Australian Casting Association's National Weight Casting perpetual trophy which dates back to the fifties and has names like Whittam, Rouse, Buckton, Tisdale (11 times), King, Morris, Cameron and many more great Champions since the establishment of the ACA. You blokes are resurrecting weight casting in Australia and it may be nice to have the 2009 Champion next to the greats of the past.
Unfortunately the national fly casting championships are in Canberra that weekend so I will not be able to attend your Geelong tournament.

Just a thought and good luck with June.

Jeremy Schrader
Serious Angler
Serious Angler
Posts: 973
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2003 9:40 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Jeremy Schrader » Sun Feb 15, 2009 7:52 am

John ,

Thats a great idea , when could I get over nad see you ?

Regards :mrgreen:

lee
Angler
Angler
Posts: 128
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:13 am

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by lee » Fri Feb 20, 2009 6:29 pm

Proposal 2 - this will take some more debate maybe. Grades for the championship. A grade - if you have a recorded cast 230 metres or bigger - B Grade - 200 to 229 metres - C Grade - 160 to 199 metres - Grade placing to be based on results of 2 comps, with newbies to be placed automatically in C grade - only stipulation that if you have reached a grade, you can't have a slightly off day and win the grade below (meaning for instance that if you are in B grade, you can't win C grade with a cast of 199 metres). And as people age and find it more difficult to keep up with a grade they can 'apply' to the executive to move down a grade - we are all mates and wouldn't make people stay up a grade if they get as old as Jeremy.
MMMM................ yeh it will take some debate. I personally don't think that 230m cuts an A grade label. If you cast 230m when on the field do you feel like an A grade caster???....................................... me neither.

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:06 pm

Lee, whilst you,me, Jeremy and Nick have cast further and would not be satisfied with that distance, we are not the only people in the competition - no one else in Australia casts that far. If you want to make it 240 then sure, but there goes Jeremy until he throws his best in Australia - what about 250 - well there goes Nick - what about 260, then by by to you (although Nick, you and Jeremy have all thrown 270 plus in practise, and you have thrown 280 plus) - it isn't a grade for what we can achieve at our best, just an opportunity to create a goal for people.

In the end, it is just an artificial attempt to give people who are not at the pointy end some sense of competition - we all know handicaps in golf are bullshit - I won the A grade championship at my club, but playing off 10, could I say I was better than the guys off 2 and 3 that I beat - no way - but it gives a bit more fun to the day.

Still, if you guys vote against it at the meeting, no worries - my ultimate goal now is to come back and see if I can match it with you and Nick (and Jeremy if he works out casting is not about strength and casts to his potential in Australia).

Scott...

Ian Cameron
Angler
Angler
Posts: 74
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:12 pm

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Ian Cameron » Fri Feb 20, 2009 7:32 pm

Co-incidentaly ? I had a phone call from a Mr Cox of the ACA a couple of nights ago wondering where the weight casting trophy is. The original silver statuette was presented to Reg Tisdell to keep as apparently no-one was ever going to beat his 11 titles. The modern aluminium and plastic replacement resides at the home of the last winner. The original trophy was one of a set of three for the three divisions of casting and were I think financed from the Australian government. They all rightly belong to the ACA but as the ACA basically told the weight casters to **** off on the times I and others contacted them over the last decade or so that moral ownership should in my opinion be forfeited to the Australian Surfcasting Federation.
Reg has passed away and I would assume his son John would be the only one to know the whereabouts of the original trophy. The plug trophy has been graciously returned by the previous holder and head and shoulders greatest plug caster we ever had, Ron - Stumpy - King and he has been presented with a plaque with all the winners names in return so I am informed.
If the new heirarchy was interested in continuing the history and the trophy was regatherered it would be no problem to turn another base to put underneath to hold the names of all the winners both past and future and keep the spirit going even if the events and rules have changed.
Ian Periera at Harrington would have more knowledge of John's whereabouts than me but I am happy to help if wanted.

Ian

lee
Angler
Angler
Posts: 128
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2006 10:13 am

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by lee » Sat Feb 21, 2009 9:30 am

90 gram wrote:.


Still, if you guys vote against it at the meeting, no worries - my ultimate goal now is to come back and see if I can match it with you and Nick (and Jeremy if he works out casting is not about strength and casts to his potential in Australia).

Scott...
which brings up something that I am unclear of, I think no matter where the 'official meeting" is, if your a member you have a vote and so, what is being voted on needs to be published so absentee votes can be taken, given the great distances that need to be traveled it's unfair to miss out on a vote because some one cant make it. It's not appropriate to do such a thing here, I had created a forum for the web site but since it hasn’t been used is was shut down, I asked them to get it going again but haven’t heard back yet, if I don’t hear back in another 24 hours I will create another. Which brings up another point the web site has been created months ago and has been waiting for "real content", I used and abbreviated WA casting website content as a so called "greeked content" to achieve my grading which was accepted. Jeremy was to create some content for the site but has obviously been too busy with work as I haven’t received any.

So what is needed is:

A welcome text
with may be a federation over view, goals, mission statement sort of thing.
Something along the lines of.........Hi and welcome blah blah blah, we are blah blah blah...our goals are blah blah blah

A history text,
From the transformation of NSW casting federation to Australian casting federation. Past events, winners to present day.
.....the ASF started as NSWCF in.....we ran comps from 1600 AD to present day.....we had this many people....we did it here....past champions were....the sport grew...during this period popularity dropped.... new interest in leader started....other states got interested...so we changed too ASF and so on

A competition text
rules, regulations, to do's, not to do's and such.

I have built it, its waiting, when I get the authorisation changes for the bank accounts, I will host it. But I need these things or its dead in the water. :|

So every one........... HELP! :mrgreen:

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:42 am

I wondered what had happened to that website - I know Mr.Schrader was going to coordinate with Ross and Leigh to get you the information.

Like you Lee, I think everyone needs a say - but I also don't think this site is the place for it - probably that should also be an agenda item when you guys have a chat in S.A.

Scott...

Jeremy Schrader
Serious Angler
Serious Angler
Posts: 973
Joined: Wed Apr 09, 2003 9:40 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by Jeremy Schrader » Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:23 pm

Guy's all your points are vailud and will be covered off at the meeting, at the moment I have been in contact with both Lee and Eddie defining some of the agenda itesm to be discussed. I will establish a simple pole for those members to put in their long distance votes on each topic . This will be done in the coming week.

Any items that members wish to have put on the agenda should send me an email or PM on the subject.

Thanks :mrgreen:

90 gram
Keen Angler
Keen Angler
Posts: 455
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 6:12 pm
Location: Wollongong

Re: An Australian Championship

Post by 90 gram » Sat Feb 21, 2009 7:37 pm

As long as the points are 'vailud' then my mind is at ease.
8)
Scott...

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests